It's just a bus, with some fancy guidance technology added. The word 'bus'
just has bad connotations, so marketing has hijacked the word 'tram'.
I just looked at the Hess website - i've ridden a number of HESS products
over the last 2 weeks, including 24.7m long monsters.
A guess what, HESS call their electric bus range 'ligh Tram'.
BTW, HESS mention Brisbane as a customer for their 24.7m long bi-artic
monster buses. (Opps, sorry it's a lightTram® 25). Is brisbane will
referring to that project as 'Brisbane Metro' (another marketing lie).
I suspect the CRRC multi-articulated electric bus would not be safe on the
U-Bahn tracks without significant modification - the 'bus' is guided by
sensors following a line of some sort (either optical or a wire in the
road) and each steering axle (there are several) controlled by electronics
and actuators. If one of the actuators fails on a normal road, as long as
the operator is on the ball, they can pull over and stop with only minimal
issues. (Assuming it wasn't the lead steer actuatior that failed!) Worst
case, they side-swipe a car. If the steering system goes wrong on the
U-Bahn guideway, they would have a wheel over the curb and the bus stuck in
seconds.
On Tue, 26 Sept 2023 at 04:22, Mark Skinner emessk@...> wrote:
> Like everything, that's true if you use technology inappropriately.
>
> What has triggered my suspicion about government technological
> incompetence is that this technology would actually seem to fit the
> Adelaide O-Bahn. So, why not try it somewhere that, on the face of it looks
> like a good idea. On the O-Bahn, it's a slightly incremental technology
> with much smaller risk.
>
> On Tue, 26 Sept 2023, 10:25 am Tony Galloway, arg@...> wrote:
>
>> That’s just like the kiddie ride trains that used to run around the
>> Darling Harbour area in Sydney.
>>
>> Ok for amusement parks, not much else.
>>
>> Tony
>>
>> On 26 Sep 2023, at 04:48, John Wayman john.wayman@...> wrote:
>>
>> I travelled on a trackless train today in Victoria on Gozo Island in
>> Malta. It seems to be a well-developed technology in use all over Europe,
>> and a similar idea to the trackless tram.
>>
>> Didn't Perth have trackless tram already, based on their first-generation
>> trams?
>>
>> Cheers
>> John Wayman
>>
>>
>>
>> Get Outlook for Android https://aka.ms/AAb9ysg
>> ------------------------------
>> *From:* 'David Batho' via TramsDownUnder tramsdownunder@...
>> >
>> *Sent:* Monday, September 25, 2023 1:32:33 PM
>> *To:*tramsdownunder@... tramsdownunder@...>
>> *Subject:* Re: [TramsDownUnder] Pseudo tram arrives in Perth
>>
>> 😂
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On 25 Sep 2023, at 21:32, David Batho dbatho@...> wrote:
>>
>> Looks very similar to the system used in Venice.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On 25 Sep 2023, at 20:59, Tony Galloway arg@...> wrote:
>>
>> It must be an “audible safety device”, like unmuffled exhaust pipes on a
>> Harley-Davidson.
>>
>> Tony
>>
>> On 25 Sep 2023, at 20:21, TP historyworks@...> wrote:
>>
>> All that effort, just to invent a trolleybus with added noise. At least
>> "the silent death" wouldn't have befallen anybody who got in front of one
>> of these mobile power saws.
>>
>> Tony P
>>
>> On Monday, 25 September 2023 at 20:13:10 UTC+10 Tony Galloway wrote:
>>
>> Well yeah, I saw this malicious expertise gutting process from the inside
>> with NSW railways.
>>
>> With regard to these rubber tyred bogus bahn things one of the leading
>> shills for them here is Professor Peter Newman, who claims to be a
>> “sustainable development expert” (yeah right) but is easily gulled by
>> pointless novelty gadgets inferior to what they purport to replace. Newman
>> supported proper LR once, but now has lost the plot with this endorsement
>> of “trackless trams”.
>>
>> This is the fool who advised Sydney Lord Mayor Clover Moore about the
>> wonders of the “wireless” tram, which meant Sydney ended up with the patent
>> restricted APS on George St. Then TfNSW, another repository of non-
>> expertise, embraced inferior battery/supercap operation for Newcastle
>> and Parramatta.
>>
>> As Newman doesn’t understand the superiority of fixed electrification
>> over storage or surface contact systems it’s hardly surprising he doesn’t
>> understand the importance of rails, or their role in differentiating a tram
>> from a bus. Once that door was opened every tout with some
>> solution-in-search-of-a-problem snake oil to peddle turned up to shill
>> their dubious wares to the credulous non-experts doing the buying. Thus we
>> have the situation where rather than the initially expensive but durable
>> and sustainable option of trams on rails with wires is adopted it is
>> usurped by an initially cheaper “alternative”, and by the time that fails
>> and has to be replaced with the real thing the culprits responsible have
>> “moved on” to where they can’t be held to account for their actions.
>>
>> Like here, where another solution-in-search-of-a-problem became the
>> problem :
>>
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TXAvuw4wX48&ab_channel=ErebosSan
>>
>> Tony
>>
>> On 25 Sep 2023, at 16:49, Mark Skinner eme...@...> wrote:
>>
>> Sort of yes. However, governments have degraded their expertise so much
>> that they have zero in house expertise in reality, especially when dealing
>> with anything new. So, previously, the public, through taxes, paid for
>> in-house knowledge of transport technology. Now, that in-house knowledge no
>> longer exists. The specialists were "let go". So now, up comes something
>> new. It sounds plausible, and it is a bus, so it IS plausible, so how to
>> evaluate it? Previously, ask the in-house experts. Now, with no in-house
>> expertise, a trial is also reasonable. So, who should pay? Why not the
>> governments that shoved expertise out the door, often contemptuously? So,
>> while yeah, this is over the top, it's the consequence of decisions made by
>> governments and endorsed by taxpayers in voting for those governments
>> repeatedly.
>>
>> Mark Skinner
>>
>> On Mon, 25 Sept 2023, 12:36 pm Tony Galloway, a...@...> wrote:
>>
>> Grifters are gunna grift….
>>
>> Tony
>>
>> On 24 Sep 2023, at 19:30, TP histor...@...> wrote:
>>
>> Yes, the City of Stirling has received funding from the Federal govt for
>> a business case and trial.
>>
>> Tony P
>>
>> On Sunday, 24 September 2023 at 17:32:12 UTC+10 Matthew Geier wrote:
>>
>> This is the same vehicle the promo pictures show the body swinging into
>> the adjacent traffic lane as it 'crosses over'?
>>
>> Over the last few days I rode the 'old style' trackless tram in two
>> different Swiss cities - Hess biarticulated trolley buses. Also equipped
>> with a fair capacity battery, if they lose the poles, they just keep going
>> to the next location that has 'pole locator hats' on the overhead. (Which
>> may be the terminal loop).
>> They were also using them on non-electrified routes.
>>
>>
>> On Sun, 24 Sept 2023 at 08:01, TP histor...@...> wrote:
>>
>> A demonstration "trackless tram" from China has arrived in Perth for
>> testing.
>>
>>
>> https://www.stirling.wa.gov.au/your-city/news/2023/september-%281%29/trackless-tram-arrives-in-stirling
>>
>> Tony P
>>
>> --
>>
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>> "TramsDownUnder" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
>> email totramsdownunde...@....
>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tramsdownunder/7dccaecc-3971-4ac9-b13b-8af6b72709fen%40googlegroups.com
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tramsdownunder/7dccaecc-3971-4ac9-b13b-8af6b72709fen%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer
>> .
>>
>>
>> --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>> "TramsDownUnder" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
>> email totramsdownunde...@....
>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tramsdownunder/ccf60655-0837-41bd-83de-e76ee9a9256fn%40googlegroups.com
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tramsdownunder/ccf60655-0837-41bd-83de-e76ee9a9256fn%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer
>> .
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>> "TramsDownUnder" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
>> email totramsdownunde...@....
>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tramsdownunder/4C811939-B8D8-4CA8-ABED-8B248F6F1786%40aapt.net.au
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tramsdownunder/4C811939-B8D8-4CA8-ABED-8B248F6F1786%40aapt.net.au?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer
>> .
>>
>>
>> --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>> "TramsDownUnder" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
>> email totramsdownunde...@....
>>
>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tramsdownunder/CAPUC4X_Ur3psm-jybreKahdwu%3DLY9sNVJ1Vtod2X4fPR8LHpJA%40mail.gmail.com
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tramsdownunder/CAPUC4X_Ur3psm-jybreKahdwu%3DLY9sNVJ1Vtod2X4fPR8LHpJA%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer
>> .
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>> "TramsDownUnder" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
>> email totramsdownunder+unsubscribe@....
>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tramsdownunder/713f4ade-c8ed-485a-8efd-b98fe3e30682n%40googlegroups.com
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tramsdownunder/713f4ade-c8ed-485a-8efd-b98fe3e30682n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer
>> .
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>> "TramsDownUnder" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
>> email totramsdownunder+unsubscribe@....
>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tramsdownunder/43D6A26C-2524-4923-A57E-936224520698%40aapt.net.au
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tramsdownunder/43D6A26C-2524-4923-A57E-936224520698%40aapt.net.au?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer
>> .
>>
>>
>> --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>> "TramsDownUnder" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
>> email totramsdownunder+unsubscribe@....
>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tramsdownunder/F7F61D53-2661-4865-92AD-C523019B1F15%40bigpond.net.au
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tramsdownunder/F7F61D53-2661-4865-92AD-C523019B1F15%40bigpond.net.au?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer
>> .
>>
>> --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>> "TramsDownUnder" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
>> email totramsdownunder+unsubscribe@....
>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tramsdownunder/IA1P223MB04012250475AA7D05B5EFC7AEFFCA%40IA1P223MB0401.NAMP223.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tramsdownunder/IA1P223MB04012250475AA7D05B5EFC7AEFFCA%40IA1P223MB0401.NAMP223.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer
>> .
>> <1000016667.jpg>
>>
>>
>> --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>> "TramsDownUnder" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
>> email totramsdownunder+unsubscribe@....
>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tramsdownunder/84F29982-9329-4C81-8805-1462AA4BCB49%40aapt.net.au
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tramsdownunder/84F29982-9329-4C81-8805-1462AA4BCB49%40aapt.net.au?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer
>> .
>>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "TramsDownUnder" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
> email totramsdownunder+unsubscribe@....
> To view this discussion on the web visit
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tramsdownunder/CAPUC4X8K6bKhdQYLWD_y50tDP0%3DXQ3CbU29TateSvD3-nSwCyQ%40mail.gmail.com
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tramsdownunder/CAPUC4X8K6bKhdQYLWD_y50tDP0%3DXQ3CbU29TateSvD3-nSwCyQ%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer
> .
>