The other negative aspect of importing everything manufactured while exporting raw materials with no added value is the adverse environmental effects of dragging stuff around on these enormous ships that burn the worst, high sulphur, high CO2 emitting fuel that is available, kill more whales and other sea mammals than Japanese “scientific research” ever has, and dump containers full of whatever toxic filth they are carrying into the ocean during storms.
But these are all considered inconvenient “externalities” by the perpetrators of this ecocide so the real cost of this global trade is concealed in the name of greed and, as always, the polluters get off free.
Tony
> On 17 Aug 2022, at 11:23, Matthew Geier matthew@...> wrote:
>
> Are we able to compare like for like though?
>
> The G class contract price almost certainly includes the new depot and 20 years of maintenance. There will be a premium for local manufacturers and yes it's not fair that the PT budget cops that cost, but the headline cost probably includes much more than the cost of the actual vehicle making direct comparisons difficult. And keeping those workers employed building them is probably cheaper than throwing them all on social security (although that comes out of a different pot of money). Although ultimately as a taxpayer, I pay either way.
>
> Mal has pointed out in the past that the G class contract includes handing over proprietary code and tools to the onboard computer systems to PTV. How much did Bombardlier jack up the price for that 'option'?
>
>
> On Wed, 17 Aug 2022 at 10:34, TP historyworks@... mailto:historyworks@smartchat.net.au> wrote:
> This month's TAUT has an item that throws some rare insight into the basic cost of a tram. Pilsen is ordering a new fleet of Skoda 40Ts, which is a 30 metre design almost identical to the Melbourne E class. The price has apparently risen 23% because of the current economic situation in Europe - to $AUD 4 million per car. The discrepancy between this and the $10 million label on a 24 metre G class car sort of puts it into perspective. I agree about encouraging local manufacturing, but I have a problem with the extra cost coming out of the public transport budget because it means you get less than half as many trams for the money at a time when you desperately need to replace old trams and/or increase the fleet - or less of some other urgent public transport need.
>
> https://zdopravy.cz/wp-content/uploads/2021/04/Tram_Plzen_3.jpg https://zdopravy.cz/wp-content/uploads/2021/04/Tram_Plzen_3.jpg
>
> Tony P
>
> On Wednesday, 10 August 2022 at 20:50:21 UTC+10 Mick Duncan wrote:
> Good one,Greg
>
> Cheers, Mick
>
>
> On 8/08/2022 4:37 pm, Gregory Robinson wrote:
>> Yarra Trams got rid of route 69 so I guess F class would be out of the question.
>> Adelaide had their F type.
>>
>> ------ Original Message ------
>> On Monday, 8 Aug, 2022 At 10:25 AM, TPhistor...@...> <> wrote:
>>
>> When this thread started we didn't know what class the new trams were going to be, so we speculated that it would be F. Subsequently it was announced that they would be G class.
>>
>> Tony P
>> (tripped up by the thread title himself)
>>
>> On Monday, 8 August 2022 at 09:30:14 UTC+10 trams4me wrote:
>> Was the F class designation for the new trams ever an official "thing" or merely a gunzel affectation?
>>
>> All the official documentation refers to "G" class, thus named as "G" is the seventh letter of the alphabet, the tram is seventh generation and thus their numbers will be 7001 - 71xx.
>>
>> Yuri.
>> --
>> Gallery at https://tinyurl.com/trams4me https://tinyurl.com/trams4me
>> ----------------------------------------
>> --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "TramsDownUnder" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email tounsub...@...">tramsdownunder+unsub...@googlegroups.com <>.
>> To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tramsdownunder/567374f0-7e35-457f-a3f0-44c1a496b7d0n%40googlegroups.com https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tramsdownunder/567374f0-7e35-457f-a3f0-44c1a496b7d0n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer.
>> --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "TramsDownUnder" group.
>
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email totramsdownunde...@... <>.
>> To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tramsdownunder/2f657584.3f4d4.1827c2ca379.Webtop.93%40telstra.com https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tramsdownunder/2f657584.3f4d4.1827c2ca379.Webtop.93%40telstra.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer.
>
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "TramsDownUnder" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email totramsdownunder+unsubscribe@... mailto:tramsdownunder+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
> To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tramsdownunder/09ef1153-0cb4-4bf5-9fc6-683028051999n%40googlegroups.com https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tramsdownunder/09ef1153-0cb4-4bf5-9fc6-683028051999n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer.
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "TramsDownUnder" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email totramsdownunder+unsubscribe@... mailto:tramsdownunder+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
> To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tramsdownunder/CAG-%3DV-Ko-_q6i0an0gutLj26%3DkOuA8rVi-E3s7sX4AF%2BvW6dnw%40mail.gmail.com https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tramsdownunder/CAG-%3DV-Ko-_q6i0an0gutLj26%3DkOuA8rVi-E3s7sX4AF%2BvW6dnw%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer.