Tony P> That would be because the quality of the public transport services
from the suburbs to the city and vv are poor, thus encouraging people to
It's a bit more nuanced than that. Some trips increased PT mode share at
the same time, as a result of the zone 2 changes.
I'd also add that some car parks actively promoted the FTZ as benefiting
Good point about car park land becoming more valuable for other uses. I
think most of the ground level car parks in Melbourne CBD have now
disappeared, though there are still plenty nearby.
On Tue, 26 Jul 2022 at 19:29, TP historyworks@...> wrote:
> That would be because the quality of the public transport services from
> the suburbs to the city and vv are poor, thus encouraging people to drive.
> I know you're well onto all those issues Daniel. When the quality of those
> services improve, the incentive to park and ride will diminish. This has
> happened in Sydney a huge lot in the last decade as a result of all the
> major investment and service expansion here.
> The other factor that will progressively come into play is that the land
> on which car parks are located eventually becomes too valuable for that use
> and they will be closed and the land redeveloped. Again, this has happened
> a lot in Sydney. Melbourne should follow not too far behind. In the
> meantime, there should be a progression that involves, as a first stage,
> encouraging people to at least drive to public transport rather than
> undertaking the whole journey by car, in cases where public transport can't
> provide their whole journey, either because it's not available or the
> service is too poor. The progression should lead eventually to people
> undertaking the whole journey by public transport when the latter is
> eventually (hopefully!) up to standard.
> To me, the desire to abandon the FTZ is a symptom of the failure over
> years to invest in the tram system, so it's short of capacity. The decision
> to go for smaller trams exacerbates that and will eventually come to bite
> Melbourne in the bum.
> Tony P
> On Tuesday, 26 July 2022 at 14:09:33 UTC+10danie...@... wrote:
>> Tony> encouraging parking to move out to the peripheries rather than
>> encouraging people to drive all the way to their destination
>> The data shows the reverse happened. After the FTZ was introduced, the
>> numbers of people driving to the CBD and surrounds from Zone 1 increased,
>> with PT mode share dropping.
>> (In contrast the Zone 2 fare cuts introduced at the same time had a
>> positive effect on PT mode share from zone 2 to the CBD.)
>> On Tue, 26 Jul 2022 at 13:22, TP histor...@...> wrote:
>>> This is a particularly Melbourne thing and very much down to the chronic
>>> lack of investment in public transport there. There simply isn't enough
>>> capacity for the existing and latent demand (capacity being a combination
>>> of vehicle size, fleet size and service frequency). Moreover, they've
>>> decided to downscale the size of the trams, a decision of epic stupidity,
>>> but I've promised to stay out of that debate as much as possible!
>>> Needless to say, free transit zones are widespread around the world,
>>> including other Australian cities, and features such as encouraging parking
>>> to move out to the peripheries rather than encouraging people to drive all
>>> the way to their destination are seen as a good thing. Only in Melbourne
>>> are they seen as a bad thing, which may be why you have people wanting to
>>> drive to and park in centres.
>>> Tony P
>>> (Who has visited and lived in Melbourne over many years and still
>>> doesn't understand how Victorians think. It's another country!)
>>> On Tuesday, 26 July 2022 at 12:02:31 UTC+10 Mal Rowe wrote:
>>>> Daniel Bowen has had an opinion piece published in today's Age
>>>> I agree with all that he says and experience what he describes, but am
>>>> not holding my breath for change - especially with an election coming
>>>> Mal Rowe in a city that has a busy heart
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