Re: Re: Sydney Metro
  Tim Boxsell

Hi Tony P. If you build it, they will come. seems like a good thing to say
about the Metro.
I noticed you mentioned that people don't mind standing even though there
are seats available.
Shows the whingers know nothing ! In Manila, the LRT 2 is a similar train
(Built by Hyundai-Rotem I think) single deck plenty of doors per side &
longitudinal seating. The distance from end to end is about a half hour
ride. I don't know the distance in KM.
The service is very popular and it's a mad rush to get on board to get a

The Hills district of Sydney is LONG overdue for any kind of transport
system & this ticks all the boxes ! Teething probs are to be expected of a
new system.

The link to the Vid of the Perth B series train outpacing the road traffic
is quite amazing.

Last time I was in Perth (1989) there were no electric trains. !


Tim, in Sydney.

On Sun, 9 Jun 2019 at 22:45, Prescott lenkaprescott@...> wrote:

> I took a ride on the metro today immediately after returning from Perth,

> so was able to do a back to back comparison of Australia's two rapid

> transit systems. Apparently the Metro has already reached its first million

> riders after a mere two weeks. I boarded at North Ryde and went to

> Tallawong and return. The trains were massively packed unless you got one

> that followed a previous one by a few minutes. Many people are using it

> locally, for shopping at Castle Hill or Rouse Hill rather than to the city.

> Many including whole families are quite obviously happy to stand even when

> seats are available. The demand is extraordinary. It's an absolutely

> transformational service for its region.


> I was most impressed by the quietness, both on the trains and the

> completely screened-off platforms - none of the roaring and screaming

> noises typical of underground stations. Pity they didn't do the same on the

> stations through North Ryde.


> The acceleration/deceleration of the trains, although far better than that

> of the double deckers, has definitely been "detuned" for "local

> expectations" compared to metro performance overseas. From familiarity with

> this syndrome with local trams, this is a process of dumbing down whereby

> the bureaucrats and engineers decide that the travelling public is

> accustomed to the lethargic pace of, in this case, the traditional suburban

> trains and it is felt that they shouldn't be subject to being frightened by

> being accelerated at warp speeds (which I'm sure they wouldn't be because

> it's smooth electric traction, but the bureaucrats think they will).


> Without having access to the figures, I deduce this by direct experience

> of back to back performances. The last European metro I rode was the very

> zippy Prague metro and, soon after, I was able to ride the Perth system.

> Although Perth had many similarities, I found that the

> acceleration/deceleration was markedly slower than that of the Prague

> metro. So since I was in Perth the last few days and rode the Sydney metro

> immediately upon return, I found straight away that the

> acceleration/deceleration of the Sydney metro trains is a tiny bit slower

> than that of the Perth trains. So from this I deduce that the Sydney metro

> is being operated quite leisurely compared to its overseas metro

> counterparts. I'm sure that could get a minute or two off some runs if they

> didn't spare the horses so much. Nevertheless, this shouldn't overshadow

> the fact that it moves along much quicker than its double deck companions

> and this is a significant achievement on its own.


> To go further into the Perth performance comparisons, I can say that the

> Fremantle-Midland line, built in the 1880s with typically 1 to 1.5 km

> station spacings, is directly comparable with the early inner Sydney lines

> that have similar stop spacings, including the Bankstown line. The Armadale

> line in Perth, built in the 1890s in a more rural environment, has average

> stop spacings of 2 to 3 km which is directly comparable with the Sydney NW

> metro. The north-south line in Perth has stop spacings of 4 km + and thus

> higher average speeds and has no direct metro counterpart in Sydney yet. So

> the most presently relevant comparisons I can present here are thus:


> Perth:

> Perth-Mosman Park (13.5 km): 11 stops, 21 minutes


> Sydney Metro:

> Sydenham-Bankstown (13.4 km): 9 stops, 21 minutes (projected time)


> Sydney Suburban:

> Sydenham-Bankstown (13.4 km): 9 stops, 25 minutes



> Perth:

> Beckenham-Armadale (16.2 km): 7 stops, 20 mins


> Sydney Metro:

> Tallawong-Cherrybrook (16 km): 6 stops, 18 mins)


> Sydney Suburban:

> Parramatta-Quakers Hill (16.7 km): 7 stops, 25 mins



> So in the case of the Bankstown line, the metro isn't anticipated to do

> quite as well as the Fremantle line. In the case of the NW line, the metro

> does a tiny bit better than than the Armadale line. Once Sydney Metro gets

> its little operational issues sorted out (and perhaps tune up the

> acceleration a bit), it will be performing as well as the Perth legacy

> lines. This smashing of the tyranny of distance with a rapid transit system

> (that also does this while maintaining the convenience of stopping at all

> stops) is a great breakthrough for Sydney.


> I found today that, as others have noted, the aircon is too cold and

> fanned at too high a speed (for winter) and the announcments are too loud.

> They need to do a far bit of fine-tuning of their various systems. I was

> also surprised to find that the door threshold/platform gaps actually

> seemed a little larger than they are in Perth, in spite of Sydney Metro

> blowing its horn about being the first fully accessible line in Australia.

> When I was riding the Armadale line the other day, a bloke in a somewhat

> large mobility scooter (complete with overhead sun canopy!) roared aboard

> the train, motored down the carriage and roared out the next door at his

> stop which had a ramp to the street (Perth either has lifts or ramps

> system-wide). When you ride around Perth you realise that its not just the

> north-south line that's accessible, it's the whole system.


> The Sydney metro trains are basically the same as the Perth B series - the

> extra door would make them the same as the upcoming C series. The bum space

> is the same as in Perth. though the padding is not quite as wide with those

> plastic gaps in betwen seats. In Perth the upholstery is continuous and is

> also better moulded to body shape. The bottom line is that they're both

> rapid transit systems with the same type of train but the benefits of

> technology progress (more than a decade apart in design) give an obvious

> advantage to Sydney - the automation and the quietness. On the stations,

> the platform screens - and particularly those stations with sound-deadening

> full-height bulkheads, creating an airport-lounge feeling like Perth

> Busport) give Sydney something special that nobody else in Australia has.


> If I'd never been to Perth I'd be awestruck, but having been to Perth I'd

> rate it right up there alongside. With our distances, rapid transit (with

> the convenience of all stops) is definitely something that AUstralian

> cities need. My wife also gave it the tick which is really something. Tens

> of thousands of Sydney northwest residents are obviously over the moon

> about it, lucky bastards.


> Tony P


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