Fw: Thurs.8.7.21 daily digest
  Roderick Smith

----- Forwarded message -----

To:australiantransportnews@... australiantransportnews@...>
Sent: Friday, 8 October 2021, 06:47:27 pm AEDT
Subject: Thurs.8.7.21 daily digest



Thurs.8.7.21 Metro Twitter
Aircraft: No ramp access to platforms until late 2021 (pedestrian-underpass works).
Flinders St: still with a lane closed for tunnel works.
Buses replace trains between North Melbourne/Sunshine and Sunbury stations at select times until the last train of Thursday 8 July (works). See https://bit.ly/3gY61fe
Argyle Avenue, Chelsea closes at the level crossing until Friday 9 July as part of level-crossing removal works. Use the Bondi Road or Chelsea Road crossings. see http://levelcrossings.vic.gov.au/disruptions/argyle-avenue-chelsea-level-crossing-closure
5.55 Werribee/Williamstown lines: Major delays Newport - Footscray while police attend to a trespasser.
- 6.21 clearing
- 6.41 Would be great if there were announcements you could hear and understand!
- Are you on a train or at a station?  If you are on a train, what carriage? We can get the PA system checked if you let us know the carriage number - it's marked near the intercom by the doors.
- Yesterday it was 'a train hit a car', today it is 'a trespasser'.   You are so full of it. Sort it out.
- Today's delays are now clearing.  In both cases, the delays/disruption were caused by issues beyond our direct control and we worked closely with  VictoriaPolice to clear the lines and restore services.
14.26 Belgrave line: Major delays (police between Ringwood and Upper Ferntree Gully). Trains may terminate at Upper Ferntree Gully or Bayswater.
- 14.38 Delays clearing.
14.55 Lilydale/Belgrave lines: Major delays (an 'operational incident' near Ringwood).
- 15.01  Delays clearing.  trains may terminate/originate at intermediate stations.
Buses replace trains Ringwood - Lilydale from 22.30 until the last train (level-crossing works).
22.42 Hurstbridge Line: Major delays (police).  Trains may be held at platforms. 
- 22.48 Still major, but recovering.

Family of technician who stole $300,000 from Opal card machines repays money. Sarah McPhee July 8, 2021
A NSW government-contracted maintenance worker who stole $300,000 from Opal card top-up machines has avoided time behind bars, one day after his family pooled their money to repay Transport for NSW.
Varol Ak, 57, pleaded guilty in the NSW District Court to two counts of larceny, being cash totals of $250,000 and $50,000, which he stole by manipulating the inner workings of the machines on at least 15,000 occasions between January 2018 and March 2019.
Varol Ak outside the NSW District Court earlier this year. CREDIT:NICK MOIR
“The family around him have, to their eternal credit, put together moneys to facilitate the repayment of the substantial sum,” Judge Craig Smith said on Thursday. “That has now been repaid.”
Ak’s lawyers tendered a Commonwealth Bank deposit receipt for $300,000 to Transport for NSW, dated July 7, 2021.
Judge Smith, taking into account a 25 per cent discount for the guilty pleas, sentenced Ak to two years and eight months’ imprisonment, to be served by way of an intensive correction order in the community.
He must not commit any offence, must submit to supervision by a community corrections officer, perform 250 hours of community service and participate in treatment by his psychologist.
“If you break any of that, there is an inevitably that will mean, or could mean, you going into full-time custody,” the judge said.
Ak, from Merrylands, cried as the court heard, in affidavits from his relatives, of the “great shame” he had brought upon himself, his family and their place in the Turkish community.
According to a psychological report, Ak’s offences had left those around him in shock and disbelief.
Ak’s partner told his psychologist, “Forget stealing, he doesn’t even gamble, nothing. I’ve never seen him in my life do anything like this.”
In his letter of apology, Ak said he had discovered a way to take money from Opal machines and “didn’t think much of it” but kept “doing it and doing it thinking it was harmless and without thinking about the impact it would have”.
“My kids barely speak to me,” he said. “I am the oldest in my family and I am meant to take care of everyone. Instead, I have let everyone down and have had to ask them to help me.”
Of the $300,000 he stole, $276,410 was deposited in a bank account in his name and largely used to make payments on a home loan, the agreed facts state.
“I accept that, on the evidence before me, the motivation for his offending, as was put by the Crown, was in a very real sense his use of the money ‘to get ahead’, in the sense of paying off a loan and likely a loan relating to his property,” Judge Smith said.
In a sentence assessment report, Ak claimed his “dishonest acts” were as a result of trying to support his family and pay off his mortgage.
Ak worked as a technician with state government contractor Cubic, then Prosegur from April 2018, to supply and maintain the Opal machines for the transport department.
According to the facts, his offending went “undetected” until a fellow Prosegur employee noticed him “acting suspiciously” while servicing Opal machines at Circular Quay and Central stations.
Varol Ak was a maintenance worker on Opal card top-up machines.CREDIT:KATE GERAGHTY
“Although maintenance technicians had access to the machines generally, they did not have the keys to access that part of the machine where the cash was kept,” the facts state.
The machine’s cash recycler drawers hold the $5, $10 and $20 notes deposited by customers or dispersed as change while larger denominations - $50 and $100 notes - go straight to the vault.
“Once a certain number of notes were accumulated in any recycler drawer, additional notes would be transferred to the vault,” the facts state.
Technicians were able to instruct the machine to empty notes from the recycler drawers into the vault, a process which involved cash being transferred one note at a time between receptacles.
Ak worked out how to “manipulate” machines by opening the covers over note transfer mechanisms.
“This in turn permitted access to a single note which one could then remove,” Judge Smith said.
“The offender utilised this method of interrupting notes to steal not less than $300,000 from Opal machines that he accessed in the course of his employment. It required at least 15,000 separate interruptions.”
Ak’s offending was further uncovered by Prosegur investigators who analysed data regarding his servicing of machines, tracked by his unique log-in code, GPS records relating to company car use and CCTV footage from various locations.
Despite being suspended from his job, Ak used his log-in five more times to steal $4770 in cash.
Judge Smith said a degree of sophistication was involved and, in the context of Ak’s employment, a breach of trust. However, he accepted Ak, who is unemployed, is a low-risk of reoffending and has excellent prospects of rehabilitation.
“I think it is almost inevitable that he would not reoffend in any way whatsoever,” Judge Smith said.
The judge convicted Ak and said the repayment of the money “supports the idea ... that he is sorry”.
RELATED ARTICLE Varol Ak has admitted to stealing at least $300,000 from Opal card machines in his role as a maintenance worker.  How a maintenance worker stole $300,000 in cash from Opal top-up machines

‘Ripped off and put back together’: Sydney’s problem-plagued ferries delayed again. Tom Rabe July 8, 2021
Sydney’s new, problem-plagued River-class ferries will be up to 18 months late amid ongoing safety concerns over a design fault that will likely require substantial remedial work on the vessels’ wheelhouse.
The 10 ferries, which were initially scheduled to be operating on Sydney Harbour by mid-2020, have not been given the green light to enter service after a litany of problems were discovered over the past 12 months.
Two of the new River-class ferries.CREDIT:JOHN BENNETT
The latest issue may push back the Indonesian-built ferries’ deployment onto Sydney Harbour and the Parramatta River by at least several months.
The problem relates to the angle of the glass in the wheelhouse of the ferries, with ongoing night-time reflection issues, forcing substantial structural changes to be undertaken over the coming months.
While the private ferry operator Transdev estimates the River-class will be able to enter service “later this year,” sources close to the project – speaking on the condition of anonymity – said the work could take anywhere from six to 12 months to complete.
They said remedial work could include cutting the wheelhouse deckhead – a vessel’s ceiling – re-angling the windows and then putting the deckhead back on.
“Something is going to have to be re-engineered. The only way to fix it now is to physically change the angle of the window,” the source said.
It has already been revealed the ferries cannot pass under two bridges on the Parramatta River if passengers are on top, have experienced stalling issues under emergency conditions and were also found to contain asbestos, which has since been removed.
The NSW government in March said the vessels would be rolled into service in “coming months” after the Herald revealed problems with their engine and gearbox caused them to stall when put into reverse during emergency stops in extreme conditions.
The revised timeline was again altered in May with more work and trials needing to be completed on the ferries due to the reflection issues. Those trials were carried out on Tuesday evening, with the problem still not resolved.
Opposition transport spokeswoman Jo Haylen said the cost of the work undertaken would likely reach into the millions. The extra cost of fixing the boats will not be charged to the government.
“These ferries cannot safely operate at night, they can’t safely travel under bridges, and they cannot emergency stop,” Ms Haylen said.
“Each ferry now has to have the wheelhouse completely ripped off, rebuilt and then put back together.”
A spokeswoman for Transdev said a trial had been undertaken on the vessels on Tuesday night to improve night-time visibility issues.
They said the trial “enabled further understanding of the issue and for all involved parties to make progress towards a viable solution”.
“Transdev is working closely with employees and Australian shipbuilder Birdon on a solution,” the spokeswoman said.
“We are confident upcoming trials will resolve the issue with the ferries to be in service later in the year.”
However, Maritime Union of Australia Sydney branch deputy secretary Paul Garrett said the boats were far from being fit for service.
“Our members want to deliver the best ferry service on the best harbour in the world. These ferries couldn’t even be considered second rate,” he said.
“These boats are 12 months overdue. Someone should have been sacked by now.”
RELATED ARTICLE Two of the new River Class ferries. ‘Cheap knock-offs’: More delays for new, problem-plagued Sydney ferries
* would you believe there is a billion dollars worth of new intercity trains sitting around idle because the Government didn't bother talking to the workers who'd be using them? That the safety and access and information technology upgrades for 450 Tangara cars is over 4 years late?
* Some of these issues should have been sorted out by an experienced builder before the design phase and not after the construction, simply because they are experienced builders.
* Does any one else remember when governments used to get voted out for being incompetent?
* Yet another example of the Transport Minister going for cheaper, overseas built product, instead of something designed for Sydney. Remember the fiasco of the intercity train fleet? Saving a few million on purchase cost, but spending billions on infrastructure to widen tunnels, alter stations so that these "cheaper" trains will fit. I'm amazed that NSW voters aren't outraged by these avoidable wastes of public money.
* Constance should be fired for sheer incompetence given his track record with trains and ferries.
* They keep spending our money on rubbish - dodgy ferries, and now apparently more gas in the 'gas-led recovery' furphy...
* Dump the new ones and stay with the old ones. At least we know they work. They are iconic on Sydney harbour, just like the ferry in Hong Kong. Cancel the new ones and get our money back
* We should be building our ferries, trains and light rail in Australia supplying jobs, training and upskilling the workforce. Every offshore purchase based solely on the price has ended up proving to be far more expensive, flawed and delayed as is demonstrated by the ferry purchase.
* A can they tell us again how much money they saved the tax payer. When it comes to purchasing anything this mob are worse than incompetent.
* Again a marvellous example of how privatisation is better, more efficient and so much cheaper
* This is what happens when one accepts the lowest of three quotes. One gets third class product.
* It's not the builder's fault. Transport4NSW designed them and wrote out the specifications and the Indonesian builders just followed the T4NSW recipe.
* Would they have been any better if made in Australia?
* They probably couldn't be any worse and it would have meant jobs for Australians.
* This is what you get for buying cheap off-the-rack stuff. Total incompetence from the Barilaro-Berejiklian Government.
* The biggest problem is that there are never any consequences when this gaggle of numbskulls stuff things up. What do you have to do in this Government and the Federal Government to get sacked.
* Another LNP stuff up ! How does the Transport Minister keep his job?
* "Someone should be sacked by now" sums it up. Couldn't be built in Australia - who made that decision? Signed off on the design - who made that decision? Paid money for these duds - who made that decision? Not really a mystery Mr Constance is it?
* Trains, light rail, ferries - his track record is appalling. Then there are the privatised buses and Newcastle light rail system.
* Rebuilding the wheelhouse? Does that mean that, previously, no skipper or wheelhouse crew could be over 1.5 metres?
* It's because the window screens cause extreme glare to the captains at night - so the angle of the windscreens needs to be reconfigured.
* This crazy ideology of the Liberal Party has to stop.
Just because they don't want union labour involved, they buy from overseas
Nothing they have bought overseas has been fit for purpose.
Trains, Buses, Ferries, Light Rail. All utter failures.
From poor design through to poor assembly and expensive maintenance.
Failures that we will be paying for for the next 20 years or more.
* As long as there's enough in the kitty for their pensions they just don't care.
* Along with the trains built in Spain, rather than Australia, that upon arrival were found to be too wide for the tunnels they were meant to go through the fiasco with the ferries goes on and on. How much longer can Berejiklian and Constance keep their jobs? Perottet must have somebody in mind for the transport portfolio when he takes over as Premier.
* it's totally incorrect to say the trains just arrived and were found to be too wide for the tunnels. For 30-40 years successive governments ignored the problem of the tunnel width in the Blue Mountains and only run old rolling stock that could fit. Finally it was decided to widen the tunnels to allow all trains (both existing and the latest purchase) to run on that line, which will provide operational efficiencies. That project was completed 12 months ago.
* Actually, the "new" Intercity trains were manufactured in Korea to a design by Transport4NSW based on British rolling stock, rather than the proven North American style we have had in NSW since the late 1870s. The North American style is much more suited to our longer distances and climate.
* Is there any project Andrew Constance hasn't botched ?
* Ferries get outsourced to a private transport company because it's "more efficient". Private transport company buys el-cheapo ferries to save money, because it's "more efficient". The ferries arrive and:
a) can't fit under bridges
b) captain can't see out the front window at night.
c) Ferries are unoperational for 12 months while remediation is done.
Ferries still won't be able to fit under bridges. Yep, that was such a brilliant saving, the private operator is SO MUCH more efficient than public transport.
* if a private company bought these ferries, it is up to that company to make sure they are fit for service and fix the problems. Note the comment "Opposition transport spokeswoman Jo Haylen said the cost of the work undertaken would likely reach into the millions. The extra cost of fixing the boats will not be charged to the government." BTW, they do fit under bridges, another misquote.
* Next time try buying Australian as we know what is required and also creates jobs
* Who is responsible for the design of the ferries?
* More short-sighted govt 'cost cutting' gone wrong....when will there be some accountability?
* This does not bode well for the Chinese built Emerald class ferries that are replacing the Manly Freshwater class ferries.
* because they are Chinese-built? They seem to do a good job on their warships and rockets etc. Indonesia is nowhere near China 'Julie'
* Another transport success brought to you by the Liberals.
* Not sure we didn't build these here. Typical Liberal party penny pinching.
* NSW Government, squandering our future for the benefit of their mates.
* Is it just me or can Gladys just not run ANY form of transportation?
* You can see these ferries in the Hastings river near port maquarie as you drive over the bridge. At first I thought they were old ferries being scrapped but alas they a new and getting remediated.
* Ferries, submarines, helicopters... What's next? Is incompetence becoming the new norm? Is it the fault of the manufacturers or the Australians expecting the whole gold-plated shebang for a budget price?
* On the contrary, we often pay over price. All these pollies who studied law yet can't write or negotiate a contract...
* Another week, another stuff up by this State Government revealed. Can somebody answer truthfully just how much money we saved (sic ) by having these ferries made in Indonesia and just how much it has cost the taxpayers of N.S.W. to rectify these seemingly never ending mistakes ????
* That's the trouble with buying a vehicle on the internet. Without a test drive you can't be sure of what you're getting until you hit the road - or water, and discover that it's not really fit for purpose.
* The comment about the inability of these new ferries to have passengers on the upper deck above Rydalmere Wharf because of a design fault is a furphy. Sydney ferries regularly run certain harbour ferries that also require all passengers to vacate the upper deck. I suspect the design brief was to have the upper deck for harbour operations.
* Agree. The concept of closing off the top deck for the run into Parramatta is a bit too hard for some people to grasp.
* “These boats are 12 months overdue. Someone should have been sacked by now.”
* Why is the NSW Government buying cheap ferries and trains from overseas when we could make them here employing Australian workers who know what is required for the local conditions. At least these ferries aren't to wide for the river (as the trains were for the track) requiring it to be widened, just to high to go under a bridge with passengers on the sun deck. Time for an election and get a government who supports Australian suppliers and workers not to mention the national economy and consumers. Time for an election and a new government.
* The Labor Party bought trains from China because they found Australian companies couldn't do it. Australian companies can't even modernise the trains they built here 30 years ago, let alone build new ones.
* Not fit for purpose. Wonderful ! but the taxpayer won't be paying for all these major modifications and patches and rebuilds.... great ! but we will be getting dodgy, bodged together Frankenstein's monster ferries instead.
* What a debacle. 
* How good is privatisation?
* Did Transdev scrutinise the design? Was there a visit from Transdev to the builder during construction to see if design and build was to the agreed contract? Given the government has handed ferries over to private enterprise what level of involvement did TFNSW have in the process?
* you mean "Look over there"? And who decided private enterprise could run the ferries better than the government?
* Apparently there is a knockout view from the top deck.
* NSW government procurement - a textbook lesson in not what to do! It is true that minister Constance is consistent in what he delivers - always late, over cost and not fit for purpose. Thank god he doesn't procure planes for us.
* Another expensive disaster by the NSW government. Name one success. You cant. You can only spin the disasters.
* 50 years ago when they enclosed the Bridge pof HMAS Vampire the windows were angled for that reason It is not as if the problem was unknown
* if the ferries are so useless, when is the concept of ministerial responsibility going to kick in and Andrew Constance resign?
* "Indonesian-built ferries" - not built here!
* 'New ferries may need roofs cut off' That headline sure made me laugh! Oh, the image in my head as ferries sailed up the Parramatta River, tops sheared off! Thanks, sub-editor. But you really do have to laugh, don't you?
* yet another contracting debacle by NSW LNP Inc. The Auditor General recently told us that Gladys, Andrew and Dominic regularly pay far too much for transport contracts - and the paying public know our needs are rarely met by such projects. Anyone with real design, engineering or project management experience would NOT have let these mistakes happen. Perhaps developing and producing LOCALLY would help - then minimum heights, window angles and quality assurance SHOULD be easier to test and check. Muppets!!
* Ferry McFerryface is starting to sound like an acceptable name.
* LNP governments… state & federal… they make so much noise about supporting workers, local business & industry then they send contracts offshore every chance they get. And then we get outcomes like this. What a stupid & unskilled country we’ve allowed ourselves to become.
* who is going to get fired ? No one as usual. And who pays for the stuff up ? We, the taxpayers do. Totally sick of wasteful spending.
* Send them back and build new ones locally
* Bit late now. The 12 month warranty ran out before they carried a single paying passenger.
* Why would a country like ours buy ferries from Indonesia?….quality control anyone…unbelievable…you get what you pay for…perhaps politicians should actually let someone with common sense knowledge look after procurement of something that actually requires a bit of expert knowledge.
* As my grandmother used to say, you get what you pay for.
* gold standard for shoddy offshore procurement that will end up costing more than locally built that work
* Perhaps it is time for some (non passenger) heads to roll. This could start with the Minister
* There’s many an old bridge over canals in European cities where one must duck down when riding in a boat while passing beneath them. No biggie.
* Some of those bridges are hundreds of years old, so its fair enough that modern transport mightn't fit. But the Parramatta bridges are not that old.
* As a ferry rider and not an engineer this sound like a fiasco created by incompetent planning. Sort of if I had designed the vessels…

Suburban Rail Loop to slash car journeys in Melbourne’s growing suburbs, secret modelling shows. Matt Johnston July 8, 2021
The Andrews Government is yet to make a business case for the Suburban Rail Loop, but secret modelling now reveals how it’ll impact motorists.
video: Suburban Rail Loop, where it goes and what it means. The state government will spend $2.2m on early works for the Suburban Rail Loop which will transform Victoria’s public transport system
Tens of thousands of motorists a day should ditch cars to travel on a new underground rail line between Cheltenham and Box Hill once built, secret modelling shows.
The wider benefits of the Andrews Government’s Suburban Rail Loop, which would eventually connect Cheltenham to Werribee via 90km of track, are to be unveiled next month in a long-awaited investment case.
One of the keys to getting motorists off the road and into trains will be the speed of services, which the Herald Sun recently revealed as 22 minutes for Stage One from Box Hill to Cheltenham.
The government says modelling on transport choices — which the government has not yet released — shows 32,500 motorists would switch to trains every day, clearing the way for other road commuters.
It’s hoped tens of thousands of motorists a day will ditch cars to travel on a new underground rail.
Daily patronage on new loop trains is expected to be significantly higher that this, but acting minister for the Suburban Rail Loop, Ben Carroll, said the traffic modelling showed benefits for all transport users.
“Suburban Rail Loop will dramatically ease congestion on Melbourne’s roads, encouraging thousands of people every day to leave their cars at home and jump on a better public transport network,” he said.
“Whether you take the train or drive the car, Suburban Rail Loop is going to change how people get around our city and state.”
The planned route for the Suburban Rail Loop
The government says motorists going between Monash and Fishermans Bend employment precincts in the morning peak would save 11 minutes.
Once the loop is built through to Melbourne Airport, 600,000 daily car trips would be avoided.
Questions have been raised about the value and feasibility of the Suburban Rail Loop, which doesn’t yet have a price tag and is not funded.
The government has already pledged construction would begin on this stage of the project, next year.
The government’s investment case is expected to show the cost for only the first 26km built between Cheltenham and Box Hill, which transport experts expect to be in the tens of billions of dollars.
It’s expected travel from Box Hill to Cheltenham will take 22 minutes.
Already $2.5 billion is being spent on planning and early works, with hundreds of home and business owners told they are likely have properties demolished to make way for stations built near to Southland, at Clayton, near to Monash University, at Glen Waverley, near to Deakin University in Burwood, and at Box Hill.
More than 500 boreholes have been drilled to test underground conditions, with a million hours worked by planners, engineers, and other staff.
One of the keys to boosting patronage would be service frequency, according to Public Transport Users Association spokesman Daniel Bowen.
Using government figures showing 13 trains are likely to be stored at a stabling yard as part of the project, he said this could lead to trains every 5 or 6 minutes.
“At what time will this high frequency apply?” he said.
“Will it be like most other Melbourne train lines currently, with turn up and go service only applying for a few hours per weekday, or will it be all day every day, first train to last, like in a real city?”
More Coverage
When homes will make way for rail loop
Travel times for Suburban rail loop revealed
West Gate Tunnel builders could take on rail loop project
* The government and its agencies will do anything except make the current system work properly: improve the signalling; fix the choke points and run frequent services. As with all Labor big bill transport projects: saturation propaganda for little substance.
* Where on earth is the Doncaster connection? Idiotic route.
* Sydney Metro, currently well under way, beats this useless project by far.
* It is a total joke and an utter embarrassment. And it will further drive Victoria into bankruptcy because it is not costed, and has no business case. I bet the unions will not allow the trains to be driverless further embarrassing Australia.
* I think the future is scooters and not cars - single person travel - make rego free for motor bikes /scooters under 150 - 200 cc and encourage motorcycle / scooter lanes on freeways - make more bike paths between stations and the electric scooters too will become more in use as they get better and cheaper / free parking everywhere - I think it's the only way to improve the congestion problem / change road rules to protect scooter riders - it is the most efficient form of transport door to door but will take a massive cultural change especially in our entitled first world cities
* Secret modelling? Why secret? Is this in a marginal electorate? Doesn't the investment stack up? Or is it simply a socialist modus operandi?
* Trains down the freeways would be easier and make more sense.
* No link to Sandringham line. Just like no link to South Yarra on the new metro tunnel. This whole concept is complete lunacy. We’d be better off building a tunnel to China… at least people might use it.
* The Big Build with no money to pay!
* good to read the Chinese Govt is again being allocated the build project.
* I will not use it for airport trips, because will go through Sunshine. Will continue to use taxis.
* It's your wallet. After having booked taxis that don't turn up too many times, I turned to UBER. Only to find that when they arrive (3 out of 4 times) that they did not have the boot space for 3 suitcases for our family.  They had baby car seats stored in their boot. Catching trains to/from airports in the UK & Europe is so much more convenient & dependable.  Not to mention much cheaper at around 1/5 to 1/20th the price (London the worst for getting a taxi to Heathrow in what is often a slow moving carpark.
* Imagine trying to do that with the lack of parking at stations …also the CBD will never be the same anyway….waste of money unless it goes to all outer suburbs
* These numbers have been massaged so much I'm surprised there's any left. Nothing but a vote buying announcement that won't even start construction in my lifetime.
* It will be so expensive it will never happen. 
* May save travelling time if you live near a railway station. However, the vast majority of people will still need to get into their car, drive to the station then spend half an hour or so looking for a parking spot before getting on a train. Rail is an expensive, outdated relic of the 19th century that can't keep up with urban sprawl or growth and only benefits a relatively small portion of society. A much improved and extensive bus network is the way to go. Buses are relatively cheap, don't need designated tracks or infrastructure, can pick up and drop off most people very near to their homes and have no problems keeping up with a growing and expanding city. 
* Why haven't they positioned the Stations here instead of where they have?:
# Cheltenham :-  Obviously locating the station adjacent the Southland Station.
Possibly Westfield who owns the area would have to agree to it and most likely they didn’t as the underground train line would have had to travel under the Southland Shopping Centre Property which could have effected there future plans ?
# Monash :-  Below Fregon Reserve to enable easy access to both The Monash Medical Centre and Monash University ?  
The Reserve could be reinstated over the top of the Monash Station ?
# Glen Waverley :-  Is in the right location.
# Burwood :-  Is in the right location close to Deakin Uni and PLC.
# Box Hill :-  Should have been adjacent or below Box Hill Central Station. 
* Don't forget to wear your mask on Public Transport also. This will be Billions over budget if we ever get to know the cost as it stands now.
* "Tens of billions of dollars for just the first 26km's", it seems an outrageous cost of our money to build a 90km line that will hardly get used! By the time it's finished, working from home would be more common & train trips down even further
* "The government says modelling on transport choices — which the government has not yet released — shows 32,500 motorists would switch to trains every day, clearing the way for other road commuters." Well, well.  The transport planning literature is full of the well-documented effect of, induced travel.  The statement above even alludes to it.  Sure, there should be a shift to the rail, but the statement goes on to say that the switch will clear the way for other road commuters.  So, the upshot is that new road commuters will also see the benefit of 'less road traffic' and begin to travel by car i.e. those that didn't drive previously, may now drive.  And over time, the road traffic will go back to what it was.  QED  What we need is a fundamental change in land use policy that obviates, or at least minimises, the need to travel distances for work, recreation, etc.
* The loop rail will become a white elephant unless you totally ban all other forms of transport. Currently, everything is centred on the Melbourne CBD and, unless the loop system travels via City Stations as they do in Paris or London, they will waste away similar to the old Outer Loop which operated when trains ruled.
* Imagine if the $18 Billion being spent on the city rail tunnel to move a few extra in and out of the city 5 days a week had been spent on moving public and private offices to the suburbs.
* "The government says modelling on transport choices — which the government has not yet released — shows 32,500 motorists would switch to trains every day, clearing the way for other road commuters." So the government is shovelling horse manure on to the mushrooms.
* Just like everything the Andrews govt touches, the cost blowout will be enormous and way way overdue.
* Makes no difference to me - I dont use and have no interest in using public transport 
* Less traffic on the road for me!
* Manangatang to Nar Nar Goon? not a popular route for most. Spend the money better! Yarra Glen to Doreen? not a popular route for most. Spend the money better! Box Hill to Cheltenham?
* Secret modelling? Isn't that just government propaganda? It's like the privacy around the health advice not being released to the public. It's spin until there is transparent open modelling done.
* 'Modelling' is another word for guessing. 'Budget' for the project is also guessing.
* A train from nowhere to nowhere. Only in Victoria and only by Daniel Andrews.
* Dan's favourite movie, other peoples money.  Another white elephant which no one needs or wants.
* Comment above ‘more than 500 bore holes have been drilled to test underground conditions’.  This was also done for the Westgate tunnel yet we still ended up with MASSIVE cost blowouts and delays due to ‘toxic soil’ - AND NO-ONE IS ACCOUNTABLE!!!!!!!!
* The stabling yard is a cleanfill site that is likely to have some amount of contaminated soil - SRL even admit they are concerned about contamination on the site. The site is surrounded by 4 other ex-landfill sites, and one they are planning to tunnel right alongside has putresible waste as well as infectious disease materials from the old Kingston infectious disease hospital. There's a huge amount of contamination risk with the preferred stabling yard, and they are risking the whole project by not even having a "Plan B" site.
* Open up Victoria by building a bridge or a tunnel from Point Nepean to Queenscliffe or Point Lonsdale to take a massive amount of traffic away for the CBD and the West Gate Bridge.
* It's about time these idiots travelled on public transport to see what an absolute farce it is currently let alone with this new you beaut "fast train" loop! Give me a break! More people than ever will be driving!
* They never will travel on public transport - in their own minds, they are too good to do so.  They are all, graduates of the 'Animal Farm' school of behaviour.  It's that simple.  And, it's even simpler for us to collectively vote them out of office in November 2022, no matter how much spin they throw at us.
* Putting aside the uncosted pork-barreling, why on earth would the Monash and Deakin stations not be on campus? It makes absolutely no sense at all. And if they are going to do it, go all the way to Sandringham for a beach stop.
* No station at Monash and Deakin because the 'braniacs' at both those universities can't see beyond their own myopic world - they have an extreme sense of hubris and no transport expertise at all.
* And when you get to Sandringham, keep going under the bay to Werribee..
* Just another Andrews government, CMFEU rort.
* Yet again Doncaster misses out. Connecting Doncaster to Box Hill should have been a priority, delivering a rail service after only a century! And why not take the line to the Bay, it seems an obvious destination?
* this is a scary project, it will take up so much money, be so over budget there will be no money other than more borrowing from this govt for anything else. who goes on this crazy circuit anyway 🤔🤔🤔😧
* Fantastic, I can’t wait to travel from Cheltenham to Werribee or vice versa, not sure what for yet?? Although werribee have a zoo, a mansion, and a sewerage treatment plant.
* This is going to be a nightmare for heatherton residents especially the stabling yard with trains coming in every 5-6 minuets are the trains going to be tooting coming in and out of the tunnel .it is disgusting that they are doing this on a green wedge which has been promised for sporting grounds .
* I thought the business case was critical to any project of this nature. Where’s the business case for any project started since you wantonly threw away $1.5B + of OUR tax money?
* We should know the ALP playbook by now - only have a business case when it suits you.  The Victorian public certainly have the business case to vote this lot out at the State election in November 2022 - we will definitely remember, no matter how much spin and pork-barrelling you throw at us.
* Another job for the Chinese company John Holland. Must be the same computer they use to get the hundreds of thousands that would die of covid, to work out these numbers. We went into lockdown to flatten the kerb as our hospitals couldn’t cope, we need more hospitals not more roads and rail, but I don’t think John Holland builds them.
* Surely they would put 4 lanes so you can have two express train services a well. Otherwise don't bother
* But that would require some common sense. Dan and common sense in the same sentence, comical. 
* What if a cost benefit analysis comes back and it shows that this is not a good project for Victorian and Australian taxpayers to invest in?  Can anyone see Andrews and his crew pulling back and adjusting? Nor can I. we need an independent analysis that stands up to rigorous scrutiny, if after this it is shown to be a great project, terrific. If not what changes can be made to ensure it is?  If not, move onto something else. 
* As if the Liberals would get the vote to do that.
* Is this the same modelling that said 20 years ago that there would be no snow in our alps by 2020? Is this the same modelling that said the regional rail from Geelong to Melbourne would stop the traffic clogging the West Gate Freeway?
don't believe it! But there was a business case for the East West Link, funny how this inept Government doesn't need a business case for this white elephant!
* Thanks to the Dan Spendathon, Victoria's net debt will hit $155B by 2024/2025 without the impact of Suburban Rail link.  Our debt will be 50% higher than NSW which has a far more diverse economy and therefore a greater chance of managing that level of financial stress. This project will simply not happen.  It was the back of a postage stamp calculated, last minute brain wave by Dan himself.  There's no business case and no one could tell you how much it might cost.  Spending $2.5B just to tell you whether it is even remotely feasible is purely negligence.
* Just another gift to the CFMEU and CCP.
* Where's the money tree? Another secret deal with China?
* Already $2.5 billion is being spent on planning and early works, and that's only for 26km built between Cheltenham and Box Hill, can't wait for the final cost $50 billion??
* another pie in the sky thought bubble thats going to cost billions of dollars and will be virtually useless unless they have the proper infrastructure at all the stations in between The way its currently looking its a very poorly thought out concept
* who believes models? Only those who create them.
* Election propaganda by the Labor Government just another one of there pet projects which will put Victoria and Victorians into more DEBT than we already are bigger DEBT the the Cain/Kirner Government era. (Mrs)
* How about they finish all the projects they have going now to see if they provide all the benefits that they have promised and to see how many BILLONS they go over budget before they commit our children’s grandchildren to more BILLIONS OF DEBT!
* What happened to due process. All this money spent and no ratified business case?? What is really going on and what is our true state debt. I am feeling that our future children’s wealth and and prosperity is going to be taxed to oblivion.
* Box Hill. The new Centre of Melbourne.
* Have they ever delivered any explanation or business case for anything??
* Near to Monash Uni and near to Deakin Uni? What does this mean? Stations that are near but doesn't service these unis are pointless. Need to get students out of their cars.  if they have to walk too far they wont use the train 
* Yes they will... they will walk for km's...anything to avoid the uni car park fees. I live in the area and see it first hand. They park very far away in residential streets, clog everyone else's car spots just so they don't have to pay for the uni car park.
* More $billions of dollars that no one will use. Who goes from Cheltenham to Box hill. How about some money for trains to Rural Victoria.
* without connecting to the Sandringham line this is just BS
* where exactly do you think the space for a new station at Sandringham would be? Parking is already non-existent near the station so it couldn't be the small car park near the station
* Majority of people in Sandringham don’t use public transport. No point extending the tunnel to there.....
* Great… a fast train that’s hard to access, through lack of stations, lack of integration, and lack of parking. Each station is seen as primarily as an interchange, not to enable new trips. At Southland the trip to the next station may be fast, but that’s after a long walk to the train platform and bypassing 8km of potential passengers. That fast trip comes at a huge cost to the community with the loss of 40 hectares of decades long planned Green Wedge parkland for the stabling yard, and loss of liveability and amenity for the Heatherton community, and the loss of the large regional sporting facilities Kingston Council were planning on the site for the whole south-east of Melbourne. So to get a benefit of 32,000 cars off the road per day, what is the real cost to the community in both $ and non-$ terms?
* The stabling yard is  an old sand mine good place for it 
* The word 'lack' is part of the Andrew's government.
Lack of planning.
Lack of honesty.
Lack of open debate.
Lack of leadership.
Lack of knowledge.
Lack of recall.
* Election BS, this will not happen for anyone in their 40”s to get any beneficial use, in fact it’ll kill the roads for ten years as they bunglevthrough I build, if it ever gets started.   Just look at the West gate tunnel project which is small compared to this nightmare.
* So they are saying tens of thousands of motorists “should” ditch their cars, not “will”! So it’s a hope but not a sure thing. With things like COVID, who would voluntarily use public transport?? No way!
* I reckon that a lot of this modelling was done prior to COVID and that factor has not been built in. The modelling will most likely be based on the traditional idea of travelling into the city or major centres to work and shop. Has not considered massive shifts in lifestyles due to COVID such as more working from home, staying local to your community, more online shopping or even moving out of the suburbs altogether. Also your point of people consciously avoiding public transport due to COVID concerns. Other infrastructure projects currently underway probably have not considered these either.
* And if it is achieved, our grandchildren's grandchildren will still be paying for it.
* I spoke to an engineer on this project and he said that large hubs were being designed at suburbs. The same as what his company has done in Dubai and Hong Kong. It removes the need for offices in the city, thus creating more apartments. He said the plans are solid. We sat together on a two hour flight.
* Post CoVid we have an excess of Business Buildings, and in Victoria stalled population growth, and a bankrupt economy.  Any modelling has to be re-done to reflect the above
* We are not Dubai or Hong Kong, nor do we want to be. It needs to be purpose built for Melbourne and it seems there are longer term plans not being announced. For example, the Monash station is in a commercial area outside of the university. Are they going to turn that into another Box Hill high rise? Why are we building mini-cities within Melbourne when we could invest in fast rail to regional centres and build them up. We are one of very few countries in the world who focus entirely on capital cities and leave the regional centres to rot.
* why would Andrews want to destroy the capital of Victoria? Australians do not want apartment living. It should be an option but not become the norm. Developers are getting rich destroying the fabric of our way of life. Apartments built in my are were so small that those wanting to downsize - something the federal government is in favour of - that purchasers bought two and demolished walls to build an acceptable lifestyle. Nearby the next set of apartments to be erected had the banner "oversized apartments" strewn across the billboard. Needless to say, there were not erected by an Australian developers.
* Another project where the taxpayers’ money is going to go down the sink!! It’s really a point to think that who will travel from Cheltenham to box hill??
* Does the business case consider the blow outs for government incompetence and union demands?
* Nobody knows.... there isn't a business case or proper costing (unless Andrews and Co. consider a dartboard "proper").
* Remove the bike lanes. There is no need for a Cheltenham - Glen Waverley line in peak hour. Just fix what the Andrew’s government has stuffed up
* That’s a lot of fix up’s then.
* that is certainly a backward way of thinking, to remove one of the things keeping more cars off the road.  Imagine if all of the people cycling stopped & suddenly started driving
* They could thin down the nature strips to make the bike lane and part of the nature strip an extra lane to cover it
* What a waste of money, more of our taxes wrecking the landscape
* Business case after the project plan. Says it all really.
* How do you build a Business Case without a Plan? Plan - Business case - Approvals - High Level Design - Contracts - Detailed Design - Construction. 
* Tens of thousands of motorists a day should ditch cars And I'll bet that they won't. So the modelling "shows 32,500 motorists would switch to trains every day". Yeah right. More garbage in, garbage out modelling.
* what an absolutely monstrous waste of money, no one will use it that doesn't already use the met anyway. i wouldn't ride a train anywhere in melbourne.
* I bet their modelling of the number of travellers who will switch to trains and their patronage numbers are wildly overstated and will end up being complete fiction. 
* When this is complete people will not be travelling by train. There will be no need to travel to work as we will work from home. We will be shopping from home so there is no need to travel for shopping.
* there is a change on how and where many work / shop etc, so have to have post CoVid Modelling For the international students could just run a tram/train line from Huntingdale to Monash down(or under) North / Wellington Rd for a fraction of the cost
* Andrews and his government are absolute hypocrites.  EWL 'had to have a business case' before being built.
* They have conveniently been unable to remember nor recall.  Selective amnesia is a wonderful thing - for them.  Let's ensure we don't forget all this in November 2022.
* Wouldn’t it make sense to have underground stations at the current station locations? New stations “near” to an existing station doesn’t make sense, it should be a seamless transition from the existing train line to the suburban loop, not a walk to a nearby station 
* This is what happens when you've removed any semblance of expertise and objectivity from within the public sector.
* 5 mins to drive to the station, 5 min wait for train  21 min travel. Then what, 5 min wait for bus, 10 min bus trip, then 5 min walk to destination. Minimum train trip time each way of 1 hour. Or jump in car, 30 min to destination, leave at your own convenient time.
* Where is Moorabbin Airport / Dingley Village station?
* Glad no mention of the Moorabbin Airport idea.
* don't believe a word of it.
* Comedy hour
* Who needs a business case when you have secret modelling, well obviously not so secret.  See, the Andrews government can be transparent.
* Typical leak of a little bit to gauge our reaction....well here it is....this is a white elephant waste of time and needs to be ditched before the election. How you wouldn't connect to the Sandy line to make a loop is phenomenally stupid.
* The actual secret modelling shows that the project is a dud, this is the "secret" modelling done so that these "results" could be leaked.
* I’ll believe when I see it.
* The Productivity Commission does not even mention this project in its list of desirable infrastructure. Neither does any other independent analyst. It's just a big white elephant to provide jobs for the CFMEU 
* With the Mornington Peninsula made a part of metro Melbourne, rail link to Rosebud or Rye is needed.
* Must be an election coming up? 'Their modelling predicts'... remind me how accurate ANY of their modelling over the pandemic was again? And tell me once more how often anything they build is ever on time and ANYWHERE NEAR the budget they forecast.
* 26 km in 22 min ,  allowing  1 min for a stop, deceleration and acceleration,  then the train has to travel at around 90  kph,  London underground trains travel at average of 33 km/h. Have a fun ride.
* you can run a fast efficient service provided you don't have to keep stopping for those pesky passengers.
* Who travels from Cheltenham to box hill?
* I'm not sure why people want to go to box hill
* it's just an ugly suburb now full of skyscrapers.  It used to be nice and green.
* It’s all through Labor-held seats.
* Is it really.  I didn't know that Labor held Cheltenham, Mount Waverly, Burwood, and Box Hill.
* Box Hill to Monash and Deakin Burwood for Andrews Belt and Road Friends?  Which takes no cars off the road
* Anyone from south of Cheltenham who doesn't want to go all the way into Richmond so they can change lines to get back to Box Hill/Glen Waverley etc, or who doesn't want to take 5 buses and about 3 hours one way.
* Foreign university students.
* And these tens of thousands of motorists will park where?
* the lack of car parks is Morrison's fault.
* And once they get off the train, how will they get to their final destination? This project is completely bonkers.
* Apparently Glen Waverley RSL doesn't need their car park. That's where the station will be. So Glen Waverley will lose parking in an already overcrowded shopping and dining precinct.
* Apparently the stations are just an "interchange", like Richmond station, so don't need parking. Heard that directly from SRL staff.

Show full size
210708Th-Melbourne'HeraldSun'-suburban.rail.loop-a-ss  |  640W x 360H  | 126.72 KB |  Photo details
Show full size
210708Th-Melbourne'HeraldSun'-suburban.rail.loop-c-ss  |  640W x 360H  | 174.59 KB |  Photo details